Simone de Beauvoir: The Second Sex
I gave you this document in class.
Read this example of feminist existentialism. Answer question 3 at the end of the excerpt (for once!). Please also answer the normal questions for blogs - POV, etc. How are existentialist ideas evident in this piece?
Due: MIDNIGHT, Thursday, April 12
Read this example of feminist existentialism. Answer question 3 at the end of the excerpt (for once!). Please also answer the normal questions for blogs - POV, etc. How are existentialist ideas evident in this piece?
Due: MIDNIGHT, Thursday, April 12
posted by RJS at
2:57 PM
8 Comments:
I just lost my entire response due to the new signup thing, so expect this to be a little less inspired. Simone de Beauvoir implies that women believe in a sort of magical world, and are more prone to think supernaturally before accepting scientific law. Along with this, she says that men are much more accepting of full explanations and fact over the mystery women set the world in. I really can't decide whether or not I agree, as either side is a bit too much of a generalization for me. It should be pointed out that the gender factor of POV is especially important here, as the work would likely be different, (or at least lack credibility), if written by a man. Existentialism is evident in that De Beauvoir says women would rather ponder over destiny than actually make something of their existence, which is the complete opposite of what an existentialist believes should be done.
By
Unknown, at Thursday, April 12, 2007 8:14:00 PM
I lost my response because of that sign up too. It's ridiculous
Alright, let's start over.
De Beauvoir explains that the thought process of women is a result of their manipulation through a male dominated world. In this world they must learn to play by the rules that constantly change according to circumstance. Because they have grown acustomed to predicting the trends of these rules, they consequently rely on what they think is intuition. De Beauvoir never states that any of these ideas are more than vague and hypothetical notions: values, morals, love, rules. Instead, they are the products of male society, a facade they use to justify their superiority and, strangely enough, attract women. These thoughts may seem at a glance to be playing off of and reinforcing the stereotypes of the time, but when she writes on such a personal and yet universal level, the truth behind the stereotypes is exposed, but a sinister cause is also unearthed. Men hold the strings in everything, and therefore women live in a world that is not real to them. Everything they live for goes back to the fact of primal sexual attraction, which I think is a very existentialist concept. You have the physical cause, but the effects, the trappings, are all products of humans trying to create meaning in their lives that seem deeper than sex, but aren't. The only thing a woman can find that trancends this mechanical sort of existance is the concept of freedom, and feminism is how she finds it. Her writing is influeced by the introduction of existentialism into her life, but the experiences she writes of are made from observations in her own life and in the lives of other women in the time period.
By
Victoria, at Thursday, April 12, 2007 10:17:00 PM
De Beauvoir implies that women are "at grips with a magical reality that defies thought" and that men live "in a consistent universe that is a reality conceivable in thought." So women pretty much live in the clouds while men live rationally. I'm not sure whether I agree or not. I do believe most women are stuck in the clouds when it comes to certain things(like love and music...and chocolate.) But I think de Beauvoir is wrong when she says "if a woman is not faithless, futile, cowardly, indolent, she loses her seductiveness..." It sounds to me like she is saying women are only appealing because they are weak and lack the courage to challenge a male, which I think reinforces the stereotype. Her statements are just a bit too loose for me.
POV is a major element in this document. De Beauvoir is a women and the document would most likely change and lose its validity if it were written by a man. She is able to stress the strengths and weaknesses of a woman-"...instead of reasoning, she dreams...while being 'physical', she is also artificial; and while being earthy, she makes herself ethereal." < I just liked that quote.
Existentailism is clear in that de Beauvoir says women believe in their intuitions rather than valid reasoning, which corresponds with the philosophy in the way that they oppose rationalism and stress a woman's unique position.
By
taylor, at Thursday, April 12, 2007 10:31:00 PM
In De Beauvoir's interpretation of the simultaneous slavery and freedom of women, she says that women think more through emotion (an old sterotype) but that they cannot help it due to physical reasons. She also says that the natural and socially normal submissiveness of women makes them attractive to men implying that men have a subconscious desire to be superior. Women are inclined to be attracted to who they see as the most successful, and traditionally success is superiority. So, in allowing men to be superior by being submissive by choice or because that is the way that society is working, women allow men to be superior and there by more attractive. I think that De Beauvoir is corect in that men think more rationally, where women go more with instinct and feeling. Though since this is the old sterotype I can't really be sure if I think this or 16 years of conditioning through the media of America thinks it for me.
This entire peice absolutely drips with the unfair treatment of women which is understanable since De Beauvoir was a feminist. She obviously thought that women were trapped by society, in that they could only excersize their small influence in being late or nagging or being slightly inconvinient in other ways. No one will ever be entirely free. To do exactly as they wish without judcial repercussions. However, De Beauvoir thinks women need to be the ones to make the change since men, wanting to be superior, will not make the change themselves.
By
manxomefoe, at Thursday, April 12, 2007 10:57:00 PM
Tegan's blog:
My story's not as important as Nate's... but it's late and my typing will probably be incoherent. Wonderful piece of literature, I must say. She captures all the tiny unmistakeable female faults and desribes them as default by what Man has made Woman. The needy, clinginess is due to Woman's nature to wait to recieve life from men. Her indecisiveness derives from the need to be an individual and the need for a man. A woman is taught, as every child, to obey the law, and therefore men, and not stand against it; but a woman also battles with her drive to be free. De Beauvoir was a woman herself, therefore she must have seen or experienced the same battle herself. It would probably be interesting to see her reaction to the sexes today.
It's interesting that she describes women as the dreaming and unrational sex as they are so often painted because though women are more emotional chemically, the world cannot expect all men to be cold, rational and calculating. A woman can't be robbed of logics and a man can't be stripped of emotion. those are human chcaracteristics with no gender specification. Other than that, I agree with what De Beauvoir says about women, their behavior, and the origins of their behavior. Existentialism is based on a drive to prove oneself to existence, to shape oneself by oneself into a purposeful being. Like Nate says, if (as de Beauvoir describes) a woman is sitting on her fannie all day dreaming of all the things life could hold instead of making life hold those things, she is far beyond existential.
By
RJS, at Monday, April 16, 2007 7:16:00 AM
Victoria S's blog:
Simone de Beauvoir says that men accept and understand factual evidence, scientific law, and logical explanations while women believe the world is a fantasy that revolves around spiritual explanations. De Beauvoir c is existentilist becuase she is writing this in her point of view as a women and says that women wait for their destiny rather than pursuing and trying to determine/control thier destiny on their own. Women are led by intuition and feeling while men are more practical and logical. Women wait for fate to take its course while men take contrl and try to make what they want to happen. As a feminist, De Beauvoir believes women should begin to take charge and make a stand so they will be viewed as equal to men in the sense of strength and reliability.
By
RJS, at Monday, April 16, 2007 7:17:00 AM
Jackson's blog:
I don't think with De Beauvoir saying that men and women think differently, she is saying an old stereotype which had been stated throughout history. As men and women are of a different gender and very different in the mind and the way they feel toward others it is obvious that they feel differently because that is how they were created. De Beauvoir isn't saying it as if women are inferior to men or vice versa, but they think accordingly to each other to please each other or something like that. Destiny and free soul are apparent throughout the excerpt obviously showing de Beauvoir's existentialist mind.
By
RJS, at Monday, April 16, 2007 7:17:00 AM
Tra-la-la hooray it's working!
So you have no idea how long my last response was, it was quite rediculous, and I lost it. Expect this to be much shorter.
De Beauvoir contrasts men and women and implies that both genders think very differently and on different levels. This I agree with wholeheartedly because men and women are concerned with very different things and are raised to think differently anyway. Boys are raised to play the little hero, dressing up in super-hero costumes all the time, battling-it-out with other boys to prove manliness. Girls are led to believe they are meant to be pretty, quiet, graceful, and they play dress up in frilly pink clothes and dream unrealistic dreams for the majority of their lives. Men are seen as rational thinkers, not tied down by emotions; Women as irrational thinkers, filled with passionate emotions and too many unrealistic dreams. Men are the better paid workers for this reason, and women resent that and believe they are being oppressed. Beauvoir also states that women lose their "seductiveness" when they are not meek, gentle, or submissive; meaning that males are attracted to submissive women because they love to dominate and be in control of other things. However, this may not be completely true, because my boyfriend disagrees with that statement and believe sometimes men need to be "challenged" when they are too full of themselves "if a guy is being a jerk, and a girl stands up for herself that's attractive in and of itself."-Says he. So I suppose that depends from person to person. POV is quite evident in the exerpt, in that Beauvoir is a woman, therefore the article would be very different if written from a male's perspective. As a woman, Beauvoir also could feel oppressed herself and be speaking for the entire female population on this. Existentialist ideas are evident in that Beauvoir states women rely on their feelings and emotions and intuitions for guidance, not rational thought processes with concrete reasoning.
By
gabriael, at Tuesday, April 17, 2007 7:51:00 PM
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